is usark over stepping its rights by proposing rules for states without asking us

[deborahbroadus]

That is just ridiculous IMO. Writing one email and forward it to a list of people is not too time consuming. Reading thousands of emails could take a lifetime.
Come on now...

That's how the government started making decisions FOR us. "It's too time consuming to get the input from the "sheep" ...."

Not a good rationalization, imo.

 

[Wolfy-hound]

So you want legislation that Wyatt wrote for your state, even though he's said he hasn't put forth any legislation in your state?

How EXACTLY would you have someone prove that they HAVEN'T done something? I mean, seriously... if you believe he's proposed legislation, let's see some proof from you!

I could say 'Prove that you did not write up XXX" and you can't prove that. You can't prove a negative.

You are all over the place, and now try backpedaling to say that you didn't say this or that, but you did. You stated more than once that microchipping killed reptiles. Now you say "oh I didn't say it kills ALL of them". You ignored the actual studies showing that MUCH more delicate reptiles and amphibians were microchipped without any ill effects. You also ignore that millions of dogs and cats have been microchipped without ill effects.

Chips are inert matter. They don't cause issues because they don't interact with the flesh. Unless you'd like to somehow claim that I've just gotten SUPER lucky(along with everyone else I know with microchipped animals, none of which have had issues) and a ton of other people are the ones with all the lousy luck, then you haven't shown that microchipping hurts in the least.

If you go to USARK's site, they usually have all the proposed stuff on the table available on the site for download.

You should really stop tossing around accusations without a shred of proof. And when will your group be up and running?

 

[ldydrgn]

Andrew answered that question on his page:

Early in the year I stopped a state legislator from introducing a bill that would have outlawed crocodilians, venomous and big constrictors. Do you remember that? I have not been talking to any Legislators in PA about introducing ANY bills

So you see? He stopped it without suggesting the proposed legislation.

 

[Cat_72]

I can't quite understand why you are taking such a strong stance against USARK trying to be proactive, and coming up with a set of compromises that may mean the difference between you keeping your animals and not having them at all?

Perhaps if put in a different setting, it may help you to comprehend? I will use as an example the Pit Bull bans that have been enacted all over the country...Denver, Colorado passed a ban on Pit bulls some years ago, and those who did not comply had their dogs seized and euthanized (well over a THOUSAND dogs killed). Nevermind that the number of dog bites actually went UP after this ban was in place for a while...it didn't matter because ALL Pit Bulls were declared to be dangerous.

While these bans have been put into place all over the US, there have been many instances where an outright ban has ONLY been avoided by devoted Pit owners COMPROMISING. They now must have a certain height of fence around their yard...keep a muzzle on their dog when it is in public...register it with the city/county...microchip the dog...whatever. Point being, of course in a perfect world they wouldn't have these restrictions, but it they comply because it allows them to keep the animals they love.

Now, I am not really even going to address your phobia of mirochipping other than to say that I have always had my dogs microchipped, and have never had a single issue with it, nor has anyone else I have ever known other than the occasional "migration" of a chip to a different location. If you look hard enough, you can find people who think just about anything is deadly and will kill you (from vaccinations to sugar to chocolate to sex and everything in between), but if you read between the lines, you can usually figure out that these are some kind of extremist views with very little ACCURATE scientific basis.

However, on your point of the cost of microchipping...I know of many people who breed dogs, as well as animal rescues, who do their own microchipping and beyond the initial cost of purchasing the equipment, the cost becomes almost negligible.

 

[GREGORY J HALL]

USARK is all we have I support them if not all reptiles will go & bans will be enacted.The press jumps on every incident thats happens badd press all the time!

 

[radera5]

That's how the government started making decisions FOR us. "It's too time consuming to get the input from the "sheep" ...."

Not a good rationalization, imo.

If you think there is really enough time...

 

[rodneynboalich]

as for the pit bulls look how it started with rules and regulations and then they moved to a ban. as for usark being the only there is pijac and they operate much like jusark with proposing rules and so on heres and email from pijac about what they are planning on doing next week in ohio

Dear Ohio Reptile Enthusiast:



Bambi Osborne, Esq. of the PIJAC staff and I are heading to Columbus Monday and Tuesday next week. We will have John Mack of Reptiles by Mack with us for this round of meetings. We are going to stay away from specifics, but will state our willingness to be involved in the process. We are going to state that since reptiles are so dissimilar to the dangerous animals that the task force is dealing with, we think it is better to deal with reptiles separately—apart from this process of the task force—whose minutes over the months indicated a lack of understanding of reptile issues. Then, if they agree we will join other industry groups to increase their body of knowledge about the issues and focus on proper caging of the larger constrictors—but that will come later. We have been having a conversation with USARK about this approach to get reptiles taken off the table for now, so I think both groups are agreed on this.



The main goal is to meet as many of the state leaders as we can, and then become part of the process of deciding how to deal with the perceived problem, which we feel is not a problem at all (but could become that “one in a million” problem if a totally unforeseen incident between a retile and a human happens). Something totally unforeseen could destroy the industry, that is why we have to make sure cages are good, etc. Adequate containment reduces the risk of an accident. More on that later!



We will let you all know how it goes, see our meetings that are set below.





Monday, November 21, 2011

7:30 am – Breakfast with Bill Byers, possible lobbyist

11:00 am – Meeting with Governor Kasich’s office and ODNR’s Scott Zody

1:00 pm – Rep. Buchy-R (Justin Barnhart) (13th Floor)

1:30 pm – Rep. Phillips -D (Kathryn McDermott) (14th Floor)

2:00 pm – Rep. Damschroder -R (Todd Thatcher) (11th Floor)

3:00 pm – Rep. Landis -R (Tim Maly) (11th Floor)

3:30 pm – Senator Jason Wilson -D (Ranking Member) (Maria Gilland) (Ground Floor)

4:00 pm – Senator Balderson _R (Zanesville district) (Josh Eck) (1st Floor)





Tuesday, November 22, 2011

9:30 am – Rep. Andy Thompson-R (Mike Sabo) (11th floor)

10:00 am – Rep. Dave Hall-R (Chair) (Mike McGuire) (11th Floor)

10:30 am – Rep. Kozlowski - R (Jeff Anthony) (13th Floor)

11:00 am – Rep. Fedor -D (Rank Member) (Marta Mudri) (10th Floor)

11:30 am – Rep. Carey -R (Kendra Kromer) (13th Floor)







Mr. Mack’s Representatives:

Rep. Jarrod Martin –R (13th Floor)

Rep. Bob Hackett -R (11th Floor)

Senator Chris Widener -R(1st Floor)





House Building: 77 S. High Street, Columbus

Senate Building: 1 Capital Square, Columbus







Mike Canning, Esq., CAE

President and CEO

Pet Industry Joint Advisory Council

1140 19th Street NW, Suite 300

Washington, DC 20036

Work: (202) 452-1525 ext 108

Cell: (202) 536-8432


here is a link to reptiles by max. he is a wholesaler of mostly geckos and ball pythons

http://www.reptilesbymack.com/pythons.php

 

[Nanci]

or that 2 year old in FL.

if we could prove even one of these chases to be a lie it would discredit all propaganda

I haven't made it to the end of this thread yet. Everyone who knows me knows the CONTEMPT I feel for the owners of the snake in that case. I would have _loved_ evidence to have been found that proved the snake was being used as a scapegoat. Yet the medical examiner found that the snake was responsible for the death. (Although not at fault, and the parents were sentenced to 12 years in prison).

 

[rodneynboalich]

now usark is suggesting registration and so is the state of ohio so they are in agreement. the thing is the state of ohio is suggesting a $1000 registration few for each species you keep. so when you say your agreeing with what usark is doing i dont think you fully understand the implications. these rules arnt just rules they are laws punishable in a court of law. keep in mind usark can set up model legislation for states to enact but how much imput do you think they will have in imposing the laws and handing out the finds and possible jail time and what the fines and jail time will be. usark can set the police but that cant control the states after they enact polices. keep in mind the people enforcing the legislation are the same people that wanted to ban the animals altogether. so how fair do you think they will be.

andrew wyatt hasnt told us what will be the out come of his model legislation.

USARK has developed model legislation that can be enacted at the state level to ensure that keepers working with certain reptiles adhere to strict caging standards, safety protocols, escape prevention plans, registration and micro-chipping.

safety protocols
escage prevention plans
registration
micro chipping

these are the rules and yet we dont know what will happen if someone dosnt comply
and what if we do and something still gos wrong. what will the fines be
what will be the rules be for selling registered snakes. can you sell to anyone or do they first have to get registered and also pay a few.

will it be a one time few or will you have to pay it every year

and how will be coming into your house to inspect your cages and if you have to have your cages inspected how often. and they come into your house anytime they want without a warrant. will we have to sacrifice are right to privacy and let the state in our homes anytime they want to inspect our snakes (our personal property).

and micro chipping will it be for all reptiles or just some and what about babies your produce and the few for micro chipping them if you have to micro chip 500 babies at $25 plus vet few so lets say total of $50 for each snake. thats $25,000. what if your producing $20 corn snakes thats $10,000. so you mite have to spend $25,000 to make $10,000.

the whole point of these regulations is to make it so hard to comply to the laws that you wont bother having these animals

 

[rodneynboalich]

now usark is suggesting registration and so is the state of ohio so they are in agreement. the thing is the state of ohio is suggesting a $1000 registration few for each species you keep. so when you say your agreeing with what usark is doing i dont think you fully understand the implications. these rules arnt just rules they are laws punishable in a court of law. keep in mind usark can set up model legislation for states to enact but how much imput do you think they will have in imposing the laws and handing out the finds and possible jail time and what the fines and jail time will be. usark can set the police but that cant control the states after they enact polices. keep in mind the people enforcing the legislation are the same people that wanted to ban the animals altogether. so how fair do you think they will be.

andrew wyatt hasnt told us what will be the out come of his model legislation.

USARK has developed model legislation that can be enacted at the state level to ensure that keepers working with certain reptiles adhere to strict caging standards, safety protocols, escape prevention plans, registration and micro-chipping.

safety protocols
escage prevention plans
registration
micro chipping

these are the rules and yet we dont know what will happen if someone dosnt comply
and what if we do and something still gos wrong. what will the fines be
what will be the rules be for selling registered snakes. can you sell to anyone or do they first have to get registered and also pay a few.

will it be a one time few or will you have to pay it every year

and how will be coming into your house to inspect your cages and if you have to have your cages inspected how often. and they come into your house anytime they want without a warrant. will we have to sacrifice are right to privacy and let the state in our homes anytime they want to inspect our snakes (our personal property).

and micro chipping will it be for all reptiles or just some and what about babies your produce and the few for micro chipping them if you have to micro chip 500 babies at $25 plus vet few so lets say total of $50 for each snake. thats $25,000. what if your producing $20 corn snakes thats $10,000. so you mite have to spend $25,000 to make $10,000.

the whole point of these regulations is to make it so hard to comply to the laws that you wont bother having these animals

i meant fee where i wrote few

 

[rodneynboalich]

so andrew just blocked from his facebook. i asked him to come on here and talk and he wont he said he read it and since no one agrees with me hes dosnt need to. i told him hes supposed to be representing me and he wont even talk to me about the issues. he just keeps calling me names. he has model legislation to hand over to my state if he feels the need and wont even send me a copy to read over.

he wont tell me what gives him the right to do so.

he wont even to begin to try to answer the question how and who will enforce the his laws.

he hasnt told us what will be the rules for registration and micro chipping will it be for all reptiles

or who will be coming into our homes to inspect our cages

he hasnt explained himself at all and you all are just going along with it

 

[AbsoluteApril]

Rodney, nothing has been enacted yet, I think you are asking hypothetical questions and possibly over-reacting a bit here.

Anyways, in 3 minutes of searching on the USARK website, I found this document from 2010 which is their 'model state legislation'
http://www.usark.org/uploads/USARK Model Reptiles.pdf

 

[rodneynboalich]

why dose this guy that is supposed to be representing us feel he dosnt have to account for his actions

 

[rodneynboalich]

Rodney, nothing has been enacted yet, I think you are asking hypothetical questions and possibly over-reacting a bit here.

Anyways, in 3 minutes of searching on the USARK website, I found this document from 2010 which is their 'model state legislation'
http://www.usark.org/uploads/USARK Model Reptiles.pdf

thanks i suck at using computers

 

[rodneynboalich]

Class 2 misdemeanor.

 

[Focal]

why dose this guy that is supposed to be representing us feel he dosnt have to account for his actions

It might have to do with your intolerant approach. Plus you have said some nasty stuff to members and some people do not enjoy being talked to in such ways.

 

[rodneynboalich]

Rodney, nothing has been enacted yet, I think you are asking hypothetical questions and possibly over-reacting a bit here.

Anyways, in 3 minutes of searching on the USARK website, I found this document from 2010 which is their 'model state legislation'
http://www.usark.org/uploads/USARK Model Reptiles.pdf

i recommend that evrybody on here go to that link and read what andrew would propose your state do and then tell me im wrong for getting mad

 

[rodneynboalich]

heres a link to a radio show that will be on tonight at 10 they will be talking about some of the same issues in this thread. looks like some people do agree with me after all.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/urbanj...esents-poisonous-protection-w-tom-crutchfield

 

[AW2EOD]

I don't think you guys know Rodney well enough, or you wouldn't waste your time replying to him.

So, Rodney...what do you propose? Down with Wyatt and USARK? Down with the only organization who is trying to help us, in our time of need? Down with compramise and let's follow the "I'm gonna keep my snakes, even if they become illegal and they have to be pried from my cold, dead hands...*insert manly battle cry here*"?

You're not a big breeder. You have a clutch or two, every year. Sure, you've kept snakes for a very long time, but that doesn't amount to a hill of beans. You stand on your pedestal, looking down at all of us "small time people", talking AT us like we're just supposed to blindly jump in line behind you, pick up our pitch forks and storm off to USARKs castle and demand they stop helping us. Sorry, but you're outlook on EVERYTHING just doesn't fly with the masses.

So, if Wyatt steps down and disbands USARK, what are you going to do? Take up the torch and demand from every state legislature that they can't take away out right to own reptiles? Are you going to converse, attend meetings and state hearings, spend tireless hours at the office...all in the name of helping us out?...and, do so without asking for a single penny, from your supports? You can't even type a sentence, using proper capilization, spelling and punctuation. Sorry, but I say Wyatt stays where he's at, HELPING US.

For those of you that aren't up to speed with the Mr. Rodney Boalich...he has a bad habit of slandering people, stating things as fact when he has no proof, doesn't care to throw people under the bus when they're trying to help him/us and just all around, thinks he knows better than everyone else, about every subject you could possibly think of.

Those of us who are supporting and spreading the good word, of USARK, are still going to be doing so. Your propaganda hasn't worked, yet again. Sorry, buddy.

 

[rodneynboalich]

I don't think you guys know Rodney well enough, or you wouldn't waste your time replying to him.

So, Rodney...what do you propose? Down with Wyatt and USARK? Down with the only organization who is trying to help us, in our time of need? Down with compramise and let's follow the "I'm gonna keep my snakes, even if they become illegal and they have to be pried from my cold, dead hands...*insert manly battle cry here*"?

You're not a big breeder. You have a clutch or two, every year. Sure, you've kept snakes for a very long time, but that doesn't amount to a hill of beans. You stand on your pedestal, looking down at all of us "small time people", talking AT us like we're just supposed to blindly jump in line behind you, pick up our pitch forks and storm off to USARKs castle and demand they stop helping us. Sorry, but you're outlook on EVERYTHING just doesn't fly with the masses.

So, if Wyatt steps down and disbands USARK, what are you going to do? Take up the torch and demand from every state legislature that they can't take away out right to own reptiles? Are you going to converse, attend meetings and state hearings, spend tireless hours at the office...all in the name of helping us out?...and, do so without asking for a single penny, from your supports? You can't even type a sentence, using proper capilization, spelling and punctuation. Sorry, but I say Wyatt stays where he's at, HELPING US.

For those of you that aren't up to speed with the Mr. Rodney Boalich...he has a bad habit of slandering people, stating things as fact when he has no proof, doesn't care to throw people under the bus when they're trying to help him/us and just all around, thinks he knows better than everyone else, about every subject you could possibly think of.

Those of us who are supporting and spreading the good word, of USARK, are still going to be doing so. Your propaganda hasn't worked, yet again. Sorry, buddy.

please listen to the radio show tonight

i produced around 160 retics last season and i moved in the middle of breeding season. i hit on seven females