• Posted 12/19/2024.
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    I am still waiting on my developer to finish up on the Classifieds Control Panel so I can use it to encourage members into becoming paying members. Google Adsense has become a real burden on the viewing of this site, but honestly it is the ONLY source of income now that keeps it afloat. I tried offering disabling the ads being viewed by paying members, but apparently that is not enough incentive. Quite frankly, Google Adsense has dropped down to where it barely brings in enough daily to match even a single paid member per day. But it still gets the bills paid. But at what cost?

    So even without the classifieds control panel being complete, I believe I am going to have to disable those Google ads completely and likely disable some options here that have been free since going to the new platform. Like classified ad bumping, member name changes, and anything else I can use to encourage this site to be supported by the members instead of the Google Adsense ads.

    But there is risk involved. I will not pay out of pocket for very long during this last ditch experimental effort. If I find that the membership does not want to support this site with memberships, then I cannot support your being able to post your classified ads here for free. No, I am not intending to start charging for your posting ads here. I will just shut the site down and that will be it. I will be done with FaunaClassifieds. I certainly don't need this, and can live the rest of my life just fine without it. If I see that no one else really wants it to survive neither, then so be it. It goes away and you all can just go elsewhere to advertise your animals and merchandise.

    Not sure when this will take place, and I don't intend to give any further warning concerning the disabling of the Google Adsense. Just as there probably won't be any warning if I decide to close down this site. You will just come here and there will be some sort of message that the site is gone, and you have a nice day.

    I have been trying to make a go of this site for a very long time. And quite frankly, I am just tired of trying. I had hoped that enough people would be willing to help me help you all have a free outlet to offer your stuff for sale. But every year I see less and less people coming to this site, much less supporting it financially. That is fine. I tried. I retired the SerpenCo business about 14 years ago, so retiring out of this business completely is not that big if a step for me, nor will it be especially painful to do. When I was in Thailand, I did not check in here for three weeks. I didn't miss it even a little bit. So if you all want it to remain, it will be in your hands. I really don't care either way.

    =====================
    Some people have indicated that finding the method to contribute is rather difficult. And I have to admit, that it is not all that obvious. So to help, here is a thread to help as a quide. How to become a contributing member of FaunaClassifieds.

    And for the record, I will be shutting down the Google Adsense ads on January 1, 2025.
  • Responding to email notices you receive.
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    In short, DON'T! Email notices are to ONLY alert you of a reply to your private message or your ad on this site. Replying to the email just wastes your time as it goes NOWHERE, and probably pisses off the person you thought you replied to when they think you just ignored them. So instead of complaining to me about your messages not being replied to from this site via email, please READ that email notice that plainly states what you need to do in order to reply to who you are trying to converse with.

Is my thinking unreasonable?

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Brandon Byers

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I e-mailed a gentleman, Gary Johnston, about a snake he had posted for sale. I live about 90 miles north of him and wanted to come to him and pick up the snake. I told him to let me know what was a good time for him and offered to go ahead and pay for the snake and me pick it up at his convenience. I gave him my cell phone # and told him he could call me. The Wed. prior to Thanksgiving he calls and I happen to be in his neck of the woods. He explains he has some things to do and now would not be a good time. That was fine. We talked for a few minutes and I told him what I had going on and how I really was glad to come across this snake and I wanted it and was willing to send payment right away if needed. I told him to call me or if he couldn't reach me e-mail me after Thanksgiving and we'll work something out. The following Monday I send him an e-mail letting him know I'll be back that way again on Tuesday if that would work for him. When I get back home Tuesday he has e-mailed me letting me know he has sold the snake. When I e-mailed him back asking what went wrong he said he called my cell phone one day Sat. or Sun. and left a message and I didn't call him back. However, I had e-mailed him on Monday and the next day he replied that he had sold the snake. I didn't get a chance to check my cell messages Sunday but man, is that not wrong to leave a message Sunday, get e-mail from me Monday, and tell me the snake is gone on Tuesday? I offered to paypal him the money or send MO or whatever to hold the snake until it was convenient for him for me to come get the snake. I have sold many a snake on the net and I can't imagine, especially after somewhat lengthy conversation on the phone about how definate someone was about wanting a snake, selling it to someone else without e-mailing them at least once before hand. Is my thinking Mr. Gary Johnston did me wrong unreasonable?

Thanks,
Brandon Byers
 
Sorry your deal fell thru.. May be a number of reasons he changed his mind some good some bad. Maybe he didn't have the snake and shipping it th ebuyer wouldn't see it till it's arrival. Maybe he didn't have the snake from the begining. The other side is miscommunication on what he heard or expected.. Alot of times people say i want it make arrangements then change mind or find better price. I would just forget about it and lok for another one...
 
Thanks Joel for the reply. I'm trying to forget about it, it's just not too often you come across an adult female Hypo. Brook's., especially when you really need one for a current project. It's the only thing I can do but it burns me up.

Brandon Byers
 
Unfortunately, The web has become quite the tool for people who want to do nothing more than waste peoples time. I understand your dissapointment. You would think that after the lengthy conversations and arrangements that were made that he would have held the snake, BUT, back to my point, until I have money in my hand a reptile isnt sold. Its sad to say, but so many jokers have ruined it for everyone!!!!! Its hard to find honest people to do biz with in this industry anymore!!! Sorry you lost out on your snake!!!!
 
Lucky

From reading your side of the what happened, it sounds like you may be very lucky. I think maybe if you had paypaled him, you would be posting here for a different reason. Good luck, and I hope you find another.
 
If the guy is that much of a flake to act like you described, you probably better count yourself fortunate that you didn't get that snake after all. It shows a complete lack of professionalism to behave like that, and I wouldn't do business with such a person in the future.
 
Brandon I am sorry it did not work out. I called you that weekend, and you did not call me back. So I went ahead and sold the animal to someone else. I figured that you lost interest. I missjudged the situation and I'm sorry. It was my understanding that you were going to call me.

Gary Johnston
 
a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush

Gary did not just turn his back and run to the next buyer as a matter of fact when I first emailed him about the brooksi he emailed me back that he had a potential buyer that was interested and that he would get back to me the next day. So he emailed me a day and half after I had emailed him about the snake and told me he had not heard from you. So I purchased her. I know that it must be very frustrating that the snake was sold very quickly, but I have to agree with reptilesplusss I can not even count how many people want to put snakes on hold or waste my time with emails phone calls and messages about buying snakes. That unfortunatly it has come to a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. To blame him seems unreasonable. I understand how frustrated you must be. But He did have me wait while he tried to get a hold of you and with some many lookers out there it is hard to know who is serious and who isn't even with phone calls. I'm sorry you feel that you were cheated some how. But what I realy want every one else know is that Gary did wait and I am very happy with my purchase and doing business with him
 
Shaun,

It seems to me that Brandon was more than just a "looker" who was hesitant about what he wanted. If he is to be believed, he said that he offered to come buy the snake before Thanksgiving. He also offered to send Gary money in more than one fashion. Brandon spoke to Gary on more than one occassion about how he could BUY that snake, and Gary put him off. Brandon then misses ONE call, and the next thing he knows, the snake is sold.

You may think that this is fine. However, Gary says that he thinks he might have used poor judgment, and I would tend to agree. It seems to me that after having talked to someone (multiple times) about coming to pick the snake up with money in hand, making sure the deal has fallen through might be a good idea before selling it to someone else.

Of course, that is why I don't usually hold snakes for people unless I have money in my hand. Gary may want to approach things a bit differently next time.

I hate to ask this, but curiosity is killing me. Gary, you didn't happen to sell this snake to Shaun for a price higher than that which you quoted to Brandon, did you? I'm not accusing anyone of anything here, but it is something that is tugging at my mind a bit.
 
Reguardless of how many times they have spoken made arrangements I still find this very frustrating that a tool such as this is being used as a weapon against an individual that did what I or even you would have done in the same situation. You did just state that you do not consider anything sold until you have money in hand. I believe that is how many of us feel with doing business. I don't mean to sound vendictive or etc. but I do believe a day and a half of waiting for some one to return a message is long enough for a buyer who is really intereseted. However, I am not here to play lawyer for anyone I have already stated that I am very happy with doing business with Gary Johnston and I do not beleive that he should be put up on this witch hunt. In fact I do wish that I never knew that this site ever existed. I beleive that if it was used properly it would make a very good tool however, the majority of what I find is a forum where people can vent there own frustrations that they have 0. out on an individual that does not deserve it. This seems to more petty than anything. No one was ripped off. If anything it was a lack of communication on both parts and if we need to blame some one. blame both of them for they both seem to have had a communication problem. And while we are all at it blame me for buying the snake.
 
We spoke once on the phone and had maybe two emails. We agreed that we would talk on Saturday or Sunday after Thanksgiving. I called him I believe Saturday and left him a message. I did not recieve the email I think until Tuesday morning from him. I thought he lost interest. He could have called me all last week and explained to me that he thought we had a misscommunication and that we still had a deal and I would have tried to make it right for him. I would have much rathered to have sold it locally for fear of shipping. I think I even explained that to Shaun. Shaun payed exactly the same that I asked of Brandon. Again Brandon if you are reading this I am sorry if you feel like I did you wrong.
Thanks,
Gary Johnston
 
Shaun,

I would NOT have done the same thing, so please do not include me in your list, thank you. I do not consider an animal sold unless I have money in my hands (except on rare occassions that suit my liking), but Brandon OFFERED to pay for this animal in at least three different ways to my counting!

1) PayPal

2) Money Order

3) He offered to come to Gary's place and pick up the animal, paying for it directly!!

Gary, for whatever reason was unable to accept these money offers when they were made. Fine. But to me, that means Gary owed Brandon a bit more than what little time he was given before you were sold the animal. I just would have handled it differently (ie: asking you to wait a day or two until I had a confirmed rejection of the animal by Brandon), but I wouldn't have put myself in this position in the first place because of the system I use in my sales.

All of that is just my opinion. I see no reason for Gary to be permenantly branded a bad guy or to suffer any other repercussion. I just think he made a poor choice, and he even said he wishes he had handled this a bit differently.

Also, Brandon did not come on here flaming Gary or anyone else. He simply stated that he thought he was wronged and wanted others to comment on whether he was out in left field on this. How is that using the BOI as a weapon? I notice that you have only recently registered on Faunaclassifieds.com and have a total of three posts (all of them in this thread, by my count). Do you really feel confident in your BOI expertise to lecture us about how this "tool" ought to be used?
 
Darren in Shaun's defense I told him that I was getting grilled on this site by you guys calling me in so many words "A Scammer". I think he thought he needed to chime in on this just as you did. I am an unknown in the herp scene. I feel like as well as he that you guys are pilling on. I have appoligized to Brandon privately he has not responded yet to my appology so I don't know where he stands. But really I think he had some part in the miscommunication also. I am man enough to admit that I should have called him again on sunday out of common curtisy. But really nothing more. Nope I didn't want the Paypal I wanted the cash when we met on the weekend. We were supposed to me on the weekend or schedule another time to meet in a phone call on the weekend. I really think that there was just a misunderstanding I don't know why Brandon chose to bring this on here but it is and I feel like I have to defend myself because I am such a "flake" as Darren put it.

Gary Johnston
 
Sounds familiar....

This seems to be a "no win" situation. There are quite a few ways that this could have been handled and all of those had upsides and potetnial downfalls. Don't fault Mr. Johnston for handling it the way he did. If you have had any reptiles for sale on the internet, then you know how many people out there "want" or "must have" what you have for sale. In this case it seems that Brandon really was interested but was the victim of unfortunate timing. I once had a black blood python for sale on kingsnake.com and had a person reply that he wanted the snake and wanted my address so he could send the payment. I did not hear back from him for a week and I e-mailed him and asked what was going on. He said he lost my address and would get out a payment overnight and he apologized. Well, a month later I put the snake back up for sale and never heard from that person again.

I guess you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. The first time I saw my name on here was for a similar situation. I could have handled it different, but I didn't. Some people agreed with me, most did not. You cannot please everyone, there is no use in trying to. But you can try to do business with people you never see or even talk to as best as you can and at the end of the day, hopefully be seen as one of the "good guys". I think by Gary posting on here and apologizing for the misunderstanding goes along way toward his character. I don't believe he needs the title of "flake" or "shady character".

Just my $0.02. Derek Roberts
 
I have to go with the seller on this one. If I left a message for a potential buyer on a cell phone Saturday morning when we had agreed to speak over the weekend, and then didn't hear from him for 48 hours, that animal would definitely be back on the market.

The buyer stated "I didn't get a chance to check my cell messages Sunday". That's a pretty lame excuse for not responding for two days. It's a cell phone. It is usually hanging from your belt. That's why we have them...ease and convenience.

I don't think either of them has committed any major faux pas here but I most assuredly do not see that the seller is in the wrong at all.
 
Let's review, shall we?

What I actually said was,

"If the guy is that much of a flake to act like you described . . ."

Note the key word in all of that: IF

I did not say that Gary was a flake. I said that IF Gary did exactly what Brandon said he did, then I think that is a flaky way to behave. I do. I still do.

However, I also said that, as far as I am concerned, Gary did not do anything wrong, per se, but that it showed poor judgment. Gary has apparently agreed to this, saying that he probably should have done differently.

As to why Brandon has not responded to Gary's appologies, I cannot say. I have no idea who Brandon is or why he might do anything.

Let me say this one last time, and then I'll try to shut up about it all. I think that if someone says, "Oh I want it! Don't sell it to anyone else!", this is entirely different from saying, "I'm going to be in your town on __________, and I want to bring you the MONEY." Brandon was obviously more than a "looker" because he tried to pay in at least three different ways. Gary, for whatever reasons (they are his own, and he is entirely entitled to them), rejected those attempts of Brandon's and he sold the snake to someone else. Personally, if a buyer was TRYING to pay for an animal, and the ONLY reason he had not yet done so was because I had put him off, I would feel a professional responsibility to give that first buyer first right of refusal.

Is Gary in the wrong? No, but to say that Brandon is using the BOI as a weapon just because he thought that this practice was unorthodox in some way and wanted some other opinions is unfair as well. To be honest, if I were Brandon, I would have left Gary's name out of it at first, if I were just looking for other opinions.

That's the way I see it on both sides. Brandon came on here, looking for opinions, and I gave mine. That's all it was.

Later --
 
Weapon or No?

Darin,

I do feel that some of the comments posted are very opinionated. (I do realize that this is what this forum is for "opinions")

And in some of the posts the opinions seemed unfair
1. Casey Hulse infers that from Brandons side of the story that it was a good thing that Brandon did not PayPal Gary.
2. In your first post you refer to him as a flake and wrote "I would not do business with such a person in the future."

I know that with the information given that they are reasonable opinions.

However, knowing what reputation means in this hobby I felt it was only fair to write in and let people know that I have done business with Gary and had a very good experience. That I believe that he had done no wrong. In fact you seem to agree with that to a point as well. In your Third post you write "I see no reason for Gary to be permenantly branded a bad guy or SUFFER ANY OTHER REPERCUSSIONS." as appossed to suggesting that one should not do business with such a person in the future as is stated in your first post.

I know that there were many OFFERS for payment made. But offers are still not sales. And to wait for "a confirmed decline" seems a little much. I'm sure that if we all waited for people who where interested in our animals to call back and tell us that they did not want them any more that we would all be waiting for phone call to this day for animals that have since been sold long ago. A day and a half of not recieving any word from some one that is a POTENTIAL buyer seems to be reasonable to most of us.

As for my using of the phrase "weapon" to discribe this forum it might have been a little rash but after reading your Third post I realize that it was not too rash after all I am not a Senior Hillbilly and after all what could a junior member intellectually or ethically offer to a Senior Hillbilly. Just because you post a lot doesn't mean you are an Applegate. Or a better lecturer than I.
 
Shaun,

The "hillbilly" thing is my way of being self-depricating. I kind of tease around about it, but I'm a little sensitive when others think they can take that bit of my person and run me around the barn with it. So, while I have not attacked you personally (only suggested that someone with as limited exposure as you currently have might not be able to fully understand what it is that we do here), I really would appreciate you not attacking me.

I am a hillbilly through and through, but I'm a hillbilly with a fairly impressive background (if I do say so for myself), and I'd like to leave the personal attacks behind before they get out of hand. Agreed?

Take Gary out of the picture for a minute. You are obviously biased toward him as you have done business with the guy and know him on some level. Obviously, he counts you as a good enough customer/friend to ask you to come to his aid here on the BOI. No problem. You may very well have very good reasons for all of this, but you have to admit that it may be clouding your perceptions a bit.

I have nothing against Gary in any way. However, if I tried (mulitple times) to buy an animal from someone (offering him CASH), and the guy put me off but said we should get together over the weekend to actually fulfill the deal, and then he called me once (didn't get me, but left a message on my cell phone), and then he sold the animal to someone else, several things would be true for me.

1) I wouldn't get mad

2) I would think the guy is a flake

3) I would think the guy is unprofessional

and

4) I wouldn't try to buy this guy's animals ever again

Now, that's just me. Obviously you have a different idea about what it means when a customer says "Hey I have the cash and I'd like to give it to you. Can I come over right now?" Is that a sale? I would say so, but apparently you would not. That's a little scary in my opinion. To each his own, I suppose . . .
 
"Brandon said he did, then I think that is a flaky way to behave. I do. I still do." How many animals have you sold over the net? People window shopping happens all the time. I dont see anything wrong here. If I was the origanal poster (name?) I would have paypaled the money right away if I was that serious. He had his email address all he had to do was puch in a password and click send money. If I was sure I wanted it, then we could have worked out the shipping/picking up details later. The simple fact is he could have paypaled Gary and didnt. He agree to talk to him on Saturday or Sunday and didnt. From what I gathered Gary fullfilled his end by calling, when he received no return call monday it was sold.

asking you to wait a day or two until I had a confirmed rejection of the animal by Brandon
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Humm and then when you never got your confimation because he decided not to respond would you have waited 4 or 5 days 8 or 9? till ya got the clue? How many chances in the mean time would you have passed to sell it?
Do you really feel confident in your BOI expertise to lecture us about how this "tool" ought to be used?
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a little high up on your soap box arent ya? although I guess I better not talk up to you with your 400+postings, since I am down with the rest in under half that
I didn't get a chance to check my cell messages Sunday
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as suncoast pointed out where was his cell? hanging from his belt? so since he couldnt live up to his end of checking his messages or calling him over the weekand as agreed, do you really think he has properly used this tool by whinning here after he didnt get his way

Brandon was obviously more than a "looker" because he tried to pay in at least three different ways
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you know how many times I have gotten phone calls from people, I wanna pay ya by credit card, oh wait I can do paypal or how about ill just overnight ya a money order "please hold that animal for me, im really gonna take it" then the money never shows I either never hear from them again or its excuse after excuse, anyway that my rant for the day
 
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